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   On 2025-12-12 12:21, The Natural Philosopher wrote:   
   > On 11/12/2025 20:59, Carlos E.R. wrote:   
   >> On 2025-12-11 19:28, John R Walliker wrote:   
   >>> On 11/12/2025 18:16, Lars Poulsen wrote:   
   >>>> On 2025-12-11, Daniel James  wrote:   
   >>>>> On 11/12/2025 04:12, c186282 wrote:   
   >>>>>> ... they just run lots of pipes on the outsides of the thick stone   
   >>>>>> walls. Works, but you'd never get away with that in modern   
   >>>>>> commercial buildings. Things have to look all neat and tidy.   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> Have you SEEN the Centre Georges Pompidou in Paris?   
   >>>>>   
   >>>>> ... or the Lloyds Insurance building in London, for that matter.   
   >>>>   
   >>>> I seem to remember hearing that there was an English building code that   
   >>>> REQUIRED outside pipes for water (and sewage?) so that they could be   
   >>>> easily thawed with a blowtorch when they froze in the winter?   
   >>>   
   >>> No, it was only done to save money.   
   >>   
   >> It seems amazing to me doing that in Britain, were pipes can freeze.    
   >> Now I understand the description of an hotel (Devon) in a novel I'm    
   >> reading (Ruth Rendell, The secret house of death).   
   >>   
   >    
   > I think the issue is that pre war, many many houses had no water, no    
   > inside toilet, no heating beyond a coal fire no electricity and so on.   
   >    
   > Hence they were upgraded to a water tank in the roof and some form of    
   > sporadic mains water supply, fed via something coming out of the ground    
   > and into the house.   
   > Drainage was often external - room size was small and the pipes were    
   > just routed outside for ease of installation. And indeed access for    
   > clearing blockages.   
   >    
   > Retrofitting modern infrastructure to old houses is massively expensive.   
      
   My city is ancient, three thousand years, but there is no river. Well    
   water tends to be salty, from the sea; mixed often. I don't know how    
   they survived. I think the water in sufficient quantities arrived in    
   1945, from a river 170 Km to the north. So before that year, houses here    
   had no bathrooms, they were built since then as houses were provided    
   with running water. Yet, I have not seen that network of pipes on the    
   outside, except for rain water from the roof.   
      
   --    
   Cheers, Carlos.   
   ES??, EU??;   
      
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