home bbs files messages ]

Just a sample of the Echomail archive

Cooperative anarchy at its finest, still active today. Darkrealms is the Zone 1 Hub.

   ENGLISH_TUTOR      English Tutoring for Students of the Eng      4,347 messages   

[   << oldest   |   < older   |   list   |   newer >   |   newest >>   ]

   Message 4,215 of 4,347   
   Alexander Koryagin to Ardith Hinton   
   Strange a bit   
   28 Oct 24 12:56:20   
   
   MSGID: 2:221/6.0 671f6dd4   
   REPLY: 1:153/716.0 71d41401   
   PID: SmapiNNTPd/Linux/IPv6 kco 20241026   
   NOTE: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows NT 6.1; WOW64; rv:31.0) Gecko/20100101   
   Thunderbird/31.7.0   
   CHRS: LATIN-1 2   
   TZUTC: 0200   
   TID: hpt/lnx 1.9 2024-03-02   
      
   Hi, Ardith Hinton!   
   I read your message from 26.10.2024 19:24   
      
      
    AK>> However in astrology   
    AH> Or numerology, methinks.... :-)   
    AK>> every letter is important and they say can change the person's   
    AK>> destiny. ;)   
      
    AH> Uh-huh. In English, you can spell a family name "Smythe" & require   
    AH> others to pronounce it "Smith". Years ago I knew somebody who did   
    AH> that. And names like "Brown" & "Clark" may be spelled with or   
    AH> without a final "e". The spelling of one's name may or may not   
    AH> influence the audience's reaction.:-Q   
      
   Probably some people want to deceive the Devil while he peruse his list of   
   those who must be taken to hell. ;-) Which Smith are you looking for? There is   
   no such a person! :)   
      
    AH>> Pronunciations in English often vary from one time & place to   
    AH>> another... and I don't know where this name originated. But IMHO   
    AH>> it's most likely the pronunciation changed & we never got around   
    AH>> to changing the spelling. I'm told that's what happened with   
    AH>> e.g. "gnash" and "knife".... :-)   
      
   I suspect that "gn" and "kn" are forgotten English diphthongs, like "th". They   
   probably sounded even more incomprehensive and tongue mutilating for common   
   people that they refused from them. Of they simply couldn't pronounce it. ;-)   
      
    AK>> It would be interesting for me to learn who threw "k" first and   
    AK>> why others started follow him. ;-)   
      
    AH> I don't know who did it or when... the OED might tell us more about   
    AH> that... but for native speakers of English, the initial consonants   
    AH> are rather difficult to pronounce without adding a vowel when one   
    AH> follows immediately on the other. I'm reminded here of the Danish   
    AH> King "Canute" (as I was taught to spell his name). During the 11th   
    AH> century he was king of England. But he was king of Denmark & Norway   
    AH> too... and many historians nowadays spell it "Cnut". While that may   
    AH> be more authentic from their POV I don't speak Danish.... :-)   
      
   It seems to me that the French origin of it is very likely, taking into   
   account the great impact it exert on English. It possible that adding a silent   
   "e" was even a mean to underline the French ancestry.   
      
    AH>> I get the impression the upper classes in Russia preferred French   
    AH>> (which may have worked for them when they didn't want the servants   
    AH>> to get the drift) until they became disenchanted with Napoleon,   
    AH>> then carefully reconstructed what's now your native language. The   
    AH>> net result from my POV is that it's a lot younger than my native   
    AH>> language & doesn't include complications like "silent letters"....   
    AK>> Yes, the French got a great impact on the Russian language, but   
    AK>> Russians did not accept those crazy silent letters. So Bordeaux in   
    AK>> Russia is just Bordo, and nobody suffers from it.   
      
    AH> To my ears, however, the second "o" is elongated. If your language   
    AH> makes no such distinction I understand. I have to keep reminding   
    AH> myself that e.g. the word "venue" is pronounced differently in   
    AH> English & French.... :-))   
      
   Yeah, the French don't like "e" at the end of words. ;-) As said one Russian   
   literature personage "there there is some mystery or a perverted tastes". ;-)   
      
   Bye, Ardith!   
   Alexander Koryagin   
   english_tutor 2024   
      
   ---    
    * Origin: nntp://news.fidonet.fi (2:221/6.0)   
   SEEN-BY: 90/1 105/81 106/201 128/187 129/305 153/757 7715 154/10 218/700   
   SEEN-BY: 218/840 221/1 6 360 226/30 227/114 229/110 114 206 300 317   
   SEEN-BY: 229/426 428 470 664 700 240/1120 266/512 282/1038 291/111   
   SEEN-BY: 301/1 113 320/219 322/757 335/364 341/66 234 342/200 396/45   
   SEEN-BY: 460/58 256 1124 5858 712/848 5020/400 1042 5054/30 5075/35   
   PATH: 221/6 301/1 460/58 229/426   
      

[   << oldest   |   < older   |   list   |   newer >   |   newest >>   ]


(c) 1994,  bbs@darkrealms.ca