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   ENGLISH_TUTOR      English Tutoring for Students of the Eng      4,347 messages   

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   Message 2,270 of 4,347   
   Anton Shepelev to alexander koryagin   
   Gerunds   
   10 Feb 17 23:41:46   
   
   Alexander Koryagin to Anton Shepelev:   
      
   AK>>> We cannot say that a gerund is a form of a noun.   
   AK>>> Otherwise we would study it when we study nouns.   
   AS>> Wherefore the sharp dichotomy, when even conventional   
   AS>> grammar acknowledges intermediate, or compound, parts   
   AS>> of speech, somewhat similarly to the wave-particle   
   AS>> dualism in quantum mechanics.   
   AK> But we should remember that "dualism" means that a thing   
   AK> carries _both_(!) qualities simultaneously. Light cannot   
   AK> be called photons OR waves.   
      
   Let me by way of an irrelevant remark observe that the   
   original particle-wave duality in physics is exactly what   
   you say it is not:   
      
     It seems as though we must use sometimes the one theory   
     and sometimes the other, while at times we may use either.   
     We are faced with a new kind of difficulty.  We have two   
     contradictory pictures of reality; separately neither of   
     them fully explains the phenomena of light, but together   
     they do.   
      
   AK> The same situation with the gerund.  It cannot be a pure   
   AK> noun.  The gerund means action, not description,   
   AK> although often it sounds similar.  IMHO, the gerund is   
   AK> closer to the verb, and that's why the gerund is studied   
   AK> usually after the verb.   
      
   I see your point but prefer the stronger notion that the   
   gerund is a verb internally (denotes action, may govern a   
   noun) and a noun externally (may be the subject or object of   
   a verb, &c).   
      
   GB>> Participles in 'ing' often become nouns.  When preceded   
   GB>> by an article, an adjective or a noun or pronoun of the   
   GB>> possessive case, they are construed as nouns; and, if   
   GB>> wholly such, have neither adverbs nor active regimen:   
   GB>> as, "He laugheth at the shaking of a spear."--Job   
   AK> IMHO, it is close to my point of view [...]   
      
   Yes, but it is its descent from a transitive verb that makes   
   "the shaking of the spear" differ essentially from "the   
   lining of the coat."  And B&S expressed this in their   
   unconventional treatment of gerunds.  Do you know any   
   grammarian that did better?   
      
   ---   
    * Origin: *** nntp://fidonews.mine.nu *** Finland *** (2:221/6.0)   

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