>>> Continued from previous message   
      
   >LL>It makes us feel good to kill people.  Especially people   
   >LL>who we claim have done bad things.  Emotionally, we cannot   
   >LL>help ourselves.  It is our nature to kill, whether we do it   
   >LL>ourselves or have somebody else do it for us.  We just do   
   >LL>not like to admit it.   
      
   BK>Which is disproven over and over, by those who cannot bring   
   BK>themselves to kill, and by those who agonize for years, or a   
   BK>lifetime, when they have to kill and do.   
      
   Have you ever watched the movie "Shutter Island"?  One of the   
   shrinks made a point by saying that everybody reaches a point   
   where he/she will become violent, so violent as to kill.  Is   
   he right?  Could the pope, who stands for peace and justice,   
   under certain conditions be pushed to the point of violence   
   where even he would kill?  What about the Dalai Lama?  Or any   
   other self-professed man/woman of nonviolence?   
      
   It is so easy for others to "justify" the death penalty when   
   they themselves do not have to off the victim.  Lethal injection   
   is the choice of death most (if not all) states have chosen to   
   use.  Until recently, for all states, it had been left up to   
   doctors to administer the drugs.  However, many doctors objected,   
   given they had taken the Hippocratic Oath (first do no harm ...).   
   Recognizing the injustice of forcing doctors to administer the   
   drugs, the state of Louisiana recently passed a bill allowing   
   non-doctors to volunteer for the job.  I'm not sure what the   
   pay is, but I'm not interested in murdering anybody, or   
   participating in that crime in any manner, shape, or form.   
      
   The death penalty is state-sponsored terrorism.  The state   
   is murdering somebody in my name.  How can anybody who calls   
   themselves a man or woman of peace support the death penalty?   
   How can any Christian do so?  Oh Jesus have mercy on my soul.   
      
   >LL>We have the death penalty in the USA.  Both at the federal   
   >LL>level, and also in most (but not all) states.  The majority   
   >LL>of people here are in favor of the death penalty, as they   
      
   BK>I doubt you can prove that.   
      
   38 states allow the death penalty.  That is a majority of states.   
   Those states would not allow the death penalty if the majority of   
   their citizens were against the death penalty.   
      
   The federal government allows the death penalty.  Given the fact   
   that 38 of our 50 states allow the death penalty, it is a safe bet   
   that a majority of people in the USA are in favor of the death   
   penalty.   
      
   Until a member of their own family is faced with the death penalty.   
      
   BK>And the death penalty fails over and over when   
   BK>juries are given the choice of life without parole.   
      
   And yet the death penalty remains on the books, available   
   for use whenever a jury/judge gets the urge.   
      
   >LL>feel (rightly or wrongly) that those who are put to death   
   >LL>deserve to die.  However, they get very uneasy when I tell   
   >LL>them the state is murdering people in their name.  Seems   
   >LL>that most folks do not like to be called "killers" or   
   >LL>"murderers" to their face.   
      
   BK>Point?   
      
   The death penalty is the state murdering people in my name.   
   That makes me a murderer, the same as the state.  How do you   
   feel having a murderer taking part in this forum?   
      
   >LL>Klingons, as do Sicilians, have a saying - "Revenge is a   
   >LL>dish best served cold."  And that is exactly what those   
   >LL>trials were after WWII, for both Europeans and Japanese.   
      
   BK>There has to be a penalty, or there is no deterrant.   
      
   The Klingons had Worf.  What does Obama have?  A nerf ball.   
      
   BK>Oh, and that was Sicilian. Gene Roddenberry stole a lot.   
      
   Yes, he did.  That's why we sent his remains to the Moon.   
      
   >LL>We wanted our revenge.  And we got it.   
      
   BK>And it was justified.   
      
   There is never any justification for murder.   
      
   --Lee   
      
      
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