BM>> John, with all due respect, if you weren't forced to pay to the   
   BM>> government your   
   BM>> money, what would you expect from the government when it comes to basic   
   BM>> infrastructure... ie. roads, transportation, police, fire, national   
   BM>> defense,   
   BM>> etc...   
      
   JM>> I think you just about covered it. Feeding the poor is NOT included on   
   JM>> my list.   
      
   BM>>So, again with all respect, you're still expecting all those services to   
   BM>>be provided to you without paying the government?  Is that correct?   
      
    TR> Feeding the poor is one thing IF its done voluntarily, and   
    TR> it doesn't stretch into other things.   
      
    Of course, if it doesn't happen at all he has no problem with it.   
      
    TR> The government has a habit of stretching things into areas   
    TR> where taxpayer money doesn't belong.   
      
    Like invading Iraq. And if the right wing has their way attacking Iran.   
      
    TR> `Welfare' was intended as a temporary aid to help people   
    TR> until they could help themselves. What it became was a way   
    TR> of life, and passed from generation to generation. And I   
    TR> KNOW that last to be an absolute fact!   
      
    What he "KNOWS" is questionable. I *KNOW* the policy of the Federal   
    Reserve Board, which is an agency of the US Government no matter what   
    anyone says about it being independent, is to fight inflation with   
    policies they know will keep people unemployed, keep people poor and in   
    need.   
      
    I *KNOW* poverty has gone down since WWII under democrats, and up under   
    republicans. I *KNOW* the debt to GDP ratio went down under every   
    president from WWII till 2009 except three anti-tax Republicans, Reagan,   
    Bush and Bush.   
      
    I seriously *SUSPECT* the republicans are deliberately keeping the debt   
    up to force the govt to cut spending on successful and popular programs.   
      
    They want to end all government efforts to educate and make available   
    employment for a lot of US citizens. They want to break the governments   
    support of an educational system that, before Bush, had the highest   
    educational attainment ranking in the world, except for Canada which tied   
    us. They want to destroy Social Security and Medicare, two of the most   
    popular and successful programs in this country's history.   
      
    Oh, and before Welfare "Reform" in the mid '90s the records showed 90% of   
    all welfare recipients got off welfare on their own, got into the private   
    sector. Only a smaller percentage stayed on welfare, and their is no   
    evidence that most of their children did not get off welfare. Those who   
    did not were not given the education and opportunity to get a job in the   
    private sector.   
      
      
   BOB KLAHN bob.klahn@sev.org   http://home.toltbbs.com/bobklahn   
      
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