Hello John,   
      
   >LL>affordable healthcare being  the first of all human rights.   
      
   >JM>BS.  Healthcare is a commodity not a right. You have no claim   
   >JM>to free service that some one has to provide.  Kinda like A person   
   >JM>has a right to music at their garden party, and the government   
   >JM>forces you to play for them for free and if you don't the government   
   >JM>will tax you.   
      
   >LL>Is access to affordable health care a human right?   
      
   JM>No.   
      
   It is, according to most of the world.   
      
   >LL>According to the most widely accepted international human rights   
   >LL>treaties, it is.   
      
   JM>Then the treaties are wrong.   
      
   We signed those treaties, incorporating those treaties as   
   being "the supreme law of the land" (US Constitution, Article VI,   
   Clause 2).   
      
   JM>Medical care is a commodity.   
      
   Access to affordable medical care is a human right, the most   
   basic of all human rights.  If medical care is not affordable,   
   it is not accessible.  By claiming medical care as being a   
   "commodity", rather than a human right, one is saying that   
   individuals have no right to life.  Nobody has the right to   
   play God.  No individual, and no society.   
      
   JM>You can not receive that care unless some one else provides   
   JM>it to you.   
      
   It is the least our society should do.   
      
   JM>What about that persons right to be compensated for ther   
   JM>service or product?   
      
   Doctors and other medical professionals are well-compensated   
   for their services.  If they weren't, they would either find   
   a new profession or move elsewhere.   
      
   JM>If you believe  you have a "right" to "free" health care,   
   JM>you must think it's OK to rob someone else to pay for it.   
      
   I agree with President Obama - I think everything should be free.   
      
   >LL>For example -   
      
   >LL>Article 25 of the U.N. Universal Declaration of Human Rights (1948)   
   >LL>reads quite clearly and emphatically:   
      
   >LL>Everyone has the right to A STANDARD OF LIVING ADEQUATE FOR THE HEALTH   
   >LL>AND WELL-BEING OF HIMSELF AND OF HIS FAMILY, including food, clothing,   
   >LL>housing and MEDICAL CARE and necessary social services, and the right t   
   >LL>security in the event of unemployment, sickness, disability, widowhood,   
   >LL>old age or other lack of livelihood in circumstances beyond his control   
      
   >LL>Do you know what that means?  THE WORLD OWES ME A LIVING!   
      
   JM>No it means theose people that came up with a wonderful   
   JM>utopian idea that will never work. You may think the world   
   JM>owes you a living but the people on it do not.   
      
   Actually, I do think the world owes me a living.  That is what   
   society is for.  To make sure each individual can survive, without   
   needless pain or suffering.  IOW, society has a duty and an obligation   
   to itself that each and every member of that society is cared for.   
   By making health care free for all, everybody would be healthier   
   and live longer, which in my opinion would be a good thing.   
      
   >LL>I have said, many times, in this very forum, that President Obama   
   >LL>was going to make everything free.  He already gave us free cell phones   
   >LL>Imagine that.  Not only free cell phones, but also 253 free minutes per   
   >LL>month.  Isn't that great?  Now he is giving us free health care.  Just   
   >LL>as he had promised.  And you are complaining?   
      
   JM>It only free to the mucher class, it's not free to those of us   
   JM>paying for it.   
      
   It should be free for everybody, not just for some or even most.   
   In such a society, we all pay for it.  And we all get to share the   
   benefits with each other.  Wouldn't that be wonderful?   
      
   >LL>I'm telling you, man.  With Obama, everything gonna be free.   
   >LL>And I'm not talking about just cell phones and food stamps.   
   >LL>I'm talking free medical care, free housing, free you name it.   
      
   >LL>Anyway, back to the main topic -   
      
   >LL>Article 12 of the U.N. International Covenant on Economic, Social, and   
   >LL>Cultural Rights (1966) also mentions access to quality healthcare as a   
   >LL>human right, plus a few other things.   
      
   JM>SO WHAT? There is no UN plan to pay for the freeloaders,   
   JM>except to tax the U.S. and that power is NOT subject to ANY   
   JM>UN treaty.   
      
   In Louisiana, we have a charity hospital system.  Those who have   
   health insurance get to have their healthcare provider pay for   
   medical services.  Those who do not have health insurance get to   
   have the state of Louisiana to pay for medical services.  It is   
   a system that has worked well for us, ever since the Long brothers   
   (Huey and Earl) set it up for us.  Unfortunately, our present   
   governor (Bobby Jindal) is trying to gut it and make it impossible   
   for people in this state to get quality medical care, or even if   
   they can get medical care at all.   
      
   >LL>The United States is a signatory to both treaties, as well as   
   >LL>several other international treaties dealing with human rights.   
   >LL>Therefore, access to quality healthcare is an accepted part of   
   >LL>the American understanding of human rights.   
      
   JM>Bull   
      
   Just the facts, my man.  Just the facts.   
      
   --Lee   
      
      
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