Re: Freedom!   
     By: John Massey to Nicholas Boel on Sat Jul 14 2012 02:21 pm   
      
    > So you say with NOTHING to substantiate your misguided belief.   
      
   Experience on both sides of the fence, buddy. That's a LOT more than what   
   you're basing your biased opinions on, that's for sure.   
      
    > That's fine. If you are happy with what they offer you.   
      
   I am. It's the best insurance and retirement package I've ever had for myself,   
   or even seen in quite some time.   
      
    > "A gloating session about your ownership of a company?"   
      
    > Show where I was GLOATING about owning a company   
      
    > > > Then does the company set your work schedule? Do you just show up to   
    > > > work  when you want to?   
      
   I took this line above as bragging that you're able to do that, and I'm not. If   
   it wasn't gloating, then it had no relevance to our conversation.   
      
    > Yes it is, but when you have nothing else...   
      
   I have plenty. It is you that is regurgitating the common crap produced by PBS   
   and other news media.   
      
    > No. You believe everything your Union tells you, don't you?   
      
   No. Had you been paying attention to what I've been saying, you would have   
   known that by now. Then again, you have the blinders on, and you have to keep   
   regurgitating the same stuff over and over, because you have no other arguments   
   based on real experience, but only from what the media has told you.   
      
    > Yep that happens in EVERY non-union shop all the time, every day I bet.   
    > and you would know that  How?  Oh yeah you worked non-union before.   
    > Yeah that' the ticket.   
      
   That's a hell of a lot better of a ticket than only knowing your facts from   
   hearsay, and the media. So if you want to keep digging a hole, go right ahead.   
      
    > Nor would you give the good ones credit.   
      
   Why wouldn't I?    
      
   Right now we're only discussing the bad things BOTH union and non-union   
   companies do. It seems as though you are the one being one-sided in this   
   discussion. I'm just making you aware that this shit doesn't just occur on the   
   union side of the fence, where you "think" and have "heard" that it happens.   
      
    > No you were to weak to stand up for your own safety.YOU needed the   
    > UUNNNIOOON to do what you were unwilling to do.   
      
   Wow, you basically threw the whole "intelligent conversation" right out the   
   window with this sentence. When the anti-unionist starts up with the whiney   
   childish remarks, it's obviously not going to get any better. :(   
      
    > Your personal tools are YOUR responsibility. Why should the company pay   
    > for your handtools?   
      
   Respect for the employee maybe? I don't know. My company replaces any tool   
   broken on the job. It's probably way over your head, maybe it's a   
   UUUUUUUUNNNNNNIOOOOOONN thing.    
      
    > No I have walked off  jobs because of safety issues.   
      
   Sorry to hear you give up that easily. Instead, you could have tried to assist   
   in making that job safer. Unfortunately, you probably didn't learn that way   
   though.   
      
    > So insteat of being effecent and professional they intentionally drag out    
    > projects to take more money from the people footing the bill.   
      
   Absolutely not. The efficiency and professionalism is there within the union   
   trades. It's the non-union general contractor that makes you have a "toolbox   
   talk" every morning which guarantees about 15-30 minutes wasted.. and rigorous   
   safety procedures that must be followed closely (way over the top of standard   
   safety procedures) that slow you down. When you have to wait an hour or two for   
   their engineers to give you a go-ahead on coping the flange of a beam to fit   
   where it needs to go.   
      
   Those large construction companies care more about their insurance costs and   
   safe man-hours than they do getting _anything_ done effeciently.   
      
    > But it does happen there and the American Taxpayer takes it on the chin.   
      
   Sure it does. Most of the time it is the rules of the general contractor, not   
   the unions. The workers just go by those rules because they have to in order to   
   keep that job.   
      
    > Your'e career sucks? I thought you were as happy as "Union Man."   
      
   I am happy. You seem to be the one trying to bring that happiness down, though.   
   Fortunately for me, you're digging yourself a media-induced hole and can't   
   produce any real facts based on knowing what you're talking about.   
      
   --   
   Nick aka axisd - telnet://bbs.pharcyde.org   
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