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   RM>> I suppose in theory exceptional people would get promoted out of the   
     >> area they are excelling in where, possibly, they could be paid more   
     >> money, especially if that re-situated them outside of the union.   
      
   MP>I think that is the part that bothers others... someone might get promoted   
     >because they are better at this, so the not better one tries to make it   
     >sound like that is somehow "unfair."   
      
   When Unions are controlling things everything is usually based on   
   seniority, how long you worked there, not how good you are.   
   The only way a company can get around that usually is to promote   
   a good person high enough they are out of the Union, but for a   
   pretty standard worker who is just better, faster and harder working   
   than the others, a promotion that high would be out of the question.   
      
   I've mentioned before that at one job I had, I was given 'Merit'   
   raises because I was doing better work than everyone else. I ended   
   up making almost double the hourly rate that I should have been   
   getting with the time I'd been there..   
      
   This was the first time in 15 years they had given anyone a   
   raise beyond the time scheduled Union raises.   
      
   The end result was I ended up getting threats from the Union   
   and suddenly others started working harder to get paid more   
   as well, and did. Who is the loser in this situation?   
      
   I suppose in theory, it means you need fewer workers which means   
   fewer people paying Union Dues.   
      
   MP>I have also worked at some places where good   
     >people get to a certain point and don't advance because management realizes   
     >the really *need* them doing what they are doing now, and promoting them   
     >will likely leave a hole somewhere.   
      
   Ha.. The last place I worked (not the one above) I eventually found   
   out that the head office in another country had seen what I had   
   accomplished there and wanted the company president where I worked   
   to offer me an opportunity to run my own branch, but they never   
   told me about it and I assume told the head office I'd refused it.   
      
   Probably noteworthy was that I soon after left that company when   
   I discovered that they were paying me about 2/3 of what someone   
   doing my job normally gets in that industry so, not only did they   
   desperately want to keep me there, they wanted to keep me cheaply..   
      
   MP>That is my general opinion of Unions.  That said, if you have a group that   
     >gets in power and tries to erode the government safety standards, Unions   
     >should in theory prevent that.  I say "in theory" as the Union may not step   
     >up if the politicians doing the eroding are the same ones they paid big   
     >money to get elected.   
      
   Yes, I can't see things like safety standards being cut back but   
   you never know, and I've seen more in the USA that in Canada where   
   minimum wage in some states is FAR lower than in others, although I   
   think your Federal gov't is starting to override that to some extent.   
      
   i.e. It looks like Wyoming and Georgia have a minimum wage of $5.15   
   but the Federal laws force that up to $7.25 /hr.   
      
   To compare, the Federal minimum wage in Canada is $17.75 /hr.   
      
   I get nightmares thinking about my first job I started at 80c /hr.  B)   
      
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