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Subject: FutureCulture Digest #376
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Issue #376
Wednesday, April 21st 1993
 
Today's Topics:
---------------
 
 Cyrpto Joke SIg
 Koresh meme
 Koresh&freedom
 MediaMOO - new environments
 Movies, MUD, and Cafenet
 Re: cafe-net and low-speed demo-networking
 Re: Encryption Back Doors?!?
 Re: whoops.
__________________________________________________________________________
 
Date: 21 Apr 1993 00:33:39 -0700
From: Eastern Arizona College and students <EASTERN@pimacc.pima.edu>
Subject: Movies, MUD, and Cafenet

Excuse the username (the one that says "Eastern Arizona College And Students"?)
My name is Ronnie Sturm ][    (the ][ being my version of a roman numeral 2, to
designate me as seperate from my father... :), and I am a student of Eastern
Arizona College using a shared account at Pima Community College... 
(Now that that's outta the way... :)

THe discussion on the FC movie has drifted to ideas for theme, or plot, or
whatever. Here's a few ideas. Take them, or leave them. (Who knows, they may
actually be useful... :)

Cyberspace, it seems, is a combination of the Net hardware, the Net Software,
and the User's Collective Imagination.
Why not focus on these?
The hardware is physical connections, datalines, Modems, Computers, Terminals
Keyboards, and yes, Cafenet locations coming to a city near you.
This can be covered by just showing them in use. no prob.
Software is everything from Telnet, to ListServers, to IRC, to MUD, to UNIX, to
VAX/VMS, to DOS, to MAC System, to Amiga System, to FTP, to all the other toys 
that we habitually play with as netrunners.
Now, the "Interesting" part to the viewer, the part that makes the net intertain
rather than just get used by businesses for interoffice mail, is the 
imigination's of the users.
Why not try to show what is going on in the head of the netrunner, as he plays
around?
Show a MUDder fighting a dragon with a vorpal sword with a few buddies, then
shift the camera away, showing a fractal sky, with gridlines, the whole
"Cyberspace" image-ala-gibson, do a mad virtual rush accross the virtual-
space, and arrive at an FTP site, which could be represented by graphic images
of massive files with wonderful treasures inside, grab the "gold", a new 
program, like a game, or something, then launch to the gridlines, attach to
an IRC discussion, show surreal text (taken from actual footage of transcripted
IRC discussions of the past) in large block-cubist letters accompanied by a
sexless/emotionless computer voice. Perhaps an introduction of the idea of the
NET movie could be taking place? then shift back to the home-node, and shift
the camera to RL footage of the hacker posting a message to the Future-culture
list?
WE are computer users. We have access to the equipment needed to do graphics
like these. A Video Toaster can handle it.
Of course, the video would need more than flashy effects, and nifty graphics,
It'd need some meat, some info to make the user think about more than the
graphics, but let's not shy away from making this neat.
"The consensual hallucination experienced daily by billions of legitimate 
operators..." is actually a bunch of text, and some wild imaginations. Let's
throw the imagination into the story, and add what draws so many users to the 
'net.

(Intellectual discussion is the other major attraction. that's the "Meat of the
Movie..."
:)

Ronnie Sturm ][
aka
Holocaust  (MUDname)
"My friends call me Holo..."
if you don't want your replies to be read by other users of this account, 
I can recieve more private email at
ronnie.sturm@solitud.fidonet.org
otherwhize, just post it to
Eastern@min.pima.edu
It's easier for me to read there....

"A friend in VR is a friend in RL....."
 
______________________________
 
From: pvanheus@cs.uct.ac.za (Peter van Heusden)
Subject: MediaMOO - new environments
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1993 11:55:16 +0200 (SAT)

Having been a player on MediaMOO (yes, we are still called players) for a while
now, and reading Eric's post, I can make a couple of comments.

1) MOO is COOL for a conversation environment. The seperate rooms, notes stuck
on walls, etc, help a lot. However, IRC is faster. In a MOO you get the 
overhead of descriptions, etc etc. Also, everyone pouring their connections to
one place is not very efficient.
2) Online libraries, etc, are coming. There is talk of doing someting like 
linking the MediaMOO library to Online Books, or something. I know AstroVR 
already has various links to other net.utils. In this way, a MOO could act
as a super-Gopher as well.
3) It is all programmable, in MOO's case with an object orientated version
of C. All that exists is the language, and you build from there. At the moment,
some of the coolest feautures (optional programming dingdads) are the "to"
feature, which allows you to prefix your message with who it is to. And in
terms of power, the networking feature is brilliant... it essentially allows
pages and online checks between numerous MOOs. I can, eg. page Haakon on
LambdaMOO while being on MediaMOO.

So, cool, and getting there very much.
Peter

*******************************************************************************
Peter van Heusden         One man one newsfeed
CS3, UCT, Cape Town, RSA  "How fast are you? How dense?"
pvanheus@cs.uct.ac.za                              - Rudy Rucker

 
______________________________
 
From: Marius Ibenhardt Watz <mariusw@ifi.uio.no>
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1993 13:29:18 +0200
Subject: Koresh meme

Re: the Koresh Kompound Going To Fiery Heaven

Does anyone recognize the smell of a self-destructive/auto-toxic
meme spiraling its way down into extinction?

Marius, recently infected by the meme of memes
 
______________________________
 
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1993 08:48:30 +0501 (EDT)
From: Donald the Secretary! <balld@gibbs.oit.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: Encryption Back Doors?!?

______________________________
 
From: the!
 
> But, here we are.  What do we do about it?  Do we just talk?  Do
> we create mailing lists and take drugs to block out the noise?  Or
> do we do something?  Try to make it better.  Most of us just want to
> get our job after school and keep on talking about the problems.  Some
> actually do something, however this number is VERY few.  Someday, maybe
> people will realize, after they have taken away the right to own and 
> operate a bbs, or the right to net access without a plastic card and five forms of id, that what is needed is action.  A political lobby, the eff, the
> coming together of this futureculture into a gestalt that says "we will
> not take this shit anymore". 
> 
> Why waste our time dreaming of what may be, why not make it happen?
> I don't know if this is right, but, so far I all I can see is net.talk.
> I know that raves are happening and that society is changing, but I live 
> in arkansas and nothing is happening here, at least nothing worth note.
> We need to make the news, not be the news.  I just feel that as I sit here
> at work and ponder all this shit on a daily basis that if we do not start
> making news, GOOD news, then we will not garner any more than a minority
> of people.  And we know what happens to minorities.  As to making it happen
> I know that some of the people on this list are making things happen.  This 
> is just a call for more political (good political) propaganda about what
> our culture is changing into.  We have to make the dweebs want it.  We have
> to romanticize our existance.  We have to get good publicity.  We have to make
> the news!  Without a good communication wagon, we will fade or just become 
> the lost heroes, those that could have been. 

(paraphrased scene from Monty Python:  Life of Brian)
"Right!  We've got to do something about this."

"Yes!  It's no good just sitting around talking about it, when action is
required."

"Right!  We could sit around all day making clever speeches and not get
anywhere."

you get the point.
just an observation.
not a criticism.
just an observation.

 
______________________________
 
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1993 08:53:48 +0501 (EDT)
From: Donald the Secretary! <balld@gibbs.oit.unc.edu>
Subject: Re: cafe-net and low-speed demo-networking

Live from New York, it's Rob Sweeney:

> use what you can get - *efficiently*.  Picture a net where, instead of a
> maxi-gigabit, Gore-y (and government-controlled) backbone, or an oligopoly of
> government and corporate backbones, you have a web, or trellis, of privately,
> or personally owned, low-speed, efficiently-utilized, and (relatively)
> cheap connections.  You build and use whatever >you< can afford.
> What ya want, I think.

> Our >own< net?

Sounds a whole lot like WWIVNet to me... which is a damned amazing little
net, if you ask me... but it, by its very nature, cannot provide the range
of services that internet can... witness:  ftp, irc, muds...  

If we're looking to get 'the net' to 'the masses,' the best option would
probably be to get some wealthy individual or corporation (yeah) to
*donate* them to various cities... perhaps in the libraries or
something... 

 
______________________________
 
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 93 08:56:08 EDT
From: rjs@devsrv1 (Rob Sweeney)
Subject: Re: whoops.

** (WARNING!  Don't (R)eply - mail to rjs doesn't work! Edit the To field!!) **

> i just said that i was responding to patrick mckee.  i see upon re-checking
> that he was the original poster of the waco rant, so an apology for
> mistaken identity.
> b.gross
> 
After posting my Waco rant, I of course noticed all sorts of editing
mistakes - misattributing patrick mckee's words as yours, including the
same text twice, that sort of thing.  I apologize for any confusion
(there's enough confusion out there already).  Damn thing took all morning
to come up with and still was full of mistakes and didn't make sense upon
later reading! 
--
/rs				Personal replies to: rsweeney@panix.com (please)
** WARNING: My outbound mailer munges addresses!  CHECK ADDRESSES WHEN REPLYING!
 
______________________________
 
Date: 21 Apr 1993 11:09:00 U
From: "Michael Maier" <michael_maier@qmgate.anl.gov>
Subject: Cyrpto Joke SIg

                       Subject:                               Time:10:10 AM
  OFFICE MEMO          Cyrpto Joke SIg                        Date:4/21/93
I thought this was a funny Sig.
===================================
Cory L. Scott      	 | Crypto Privacy is like a bullet proof vest for your
cls6@midway.uchicago.edu | transmitted speech; the Clipper chip is a paper
University of Chicago    | jacket with extra zippers in the back.
===================================
Cory is trying to arrange a meeting @ UofC to discuss this important issue
(ie-Clipper Chip).

Michael Unscene

 
______________________________
 
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 93 11:14:02 EDT
From: rjs@devsrv1 (Rob Sweeney)
Subject: Re: cafe-net and low-speed demo-networking

** (WARNING!  Don't (R)eply - mail to rjs doesn't work! Edit the To field!!) **

Donald the Secretary! <balld@gibbs.oit.unc.edu> pounds on his IBM Selectric, 
scans the watermarked output, and we find...
> Sounds a whole lot like WWIVNet to me... which is a damned amazing little
> net, if you ask me... but it, by its very nature, cannot provide the range
> of services that internet can... witness:  ftp, irc, muds...  

yeah, sorta.  The Internet and BBS communities ought to talk to each
other a bit more - they're both trying to solve the same kinds of
problems.  What I'm looking at re: low cost networking, my untimed
phone line question, etc. is what it would take to put together relatively
low-speed, but *directly connected* net - a cheapo, private net with
the same functionality as the Internet, but slower because instead of
relying on Our Pal Al (and Company) for funding hi-speed backbones,
local connectivity is provided thru, say, 14.4kbps modem links.  Long-distance
links are more of a problem, but there are ways - the recent packet-radio
discussion is in that direction.  I suspect that a trellis of low-speed
connections - with appropriate software - would work as well for most
Internet applications - *if rewritten with the network limitations in mind* -
as the existing net.  Slower, but as functional.. 

> If we're looking to get 'the net' to 'the masses,' the best option would
> probably be to get some wealthy individual or corporation (yeah) to
> *donate* them to various cities... perhaps in the libraries or
> something...

that's not my goal, but it might be some people's.  There's lots of
issues we could get into re: getting the net to the 'masses' or not.
If you're into the sugar-daddy approach, look no further than the
government.  Libaries, for example - there's a multi-million (well beyond
10 - not sure of the exact number but could easily find out) USD Federal
grant that the ALA (American Library Association) is trying to get its
paws on - for getting every (or a very signifigant proportion) library
"on the Internet" - for whatever unstated (and probably unknown - they
sure as hell don't know) purpose.

My goal?  I don't know exactly.  My political sentiments place me way out
in the libertarian-radical left (or right, depending on yer POV) field.
I am emphatically opposed to government-spearheaded expansion of 'the net'
(and just about everything else) on numerous grounds.  I think that there
should be lots of ways that interested people might get themselves on
the net.  Further, I want the net to be there when we need it, meaning
that I don't want someone - anyone - to be able to pull the plug, or
pull such a big plug that the parts that are still working collapse under
the load.

Cafes, public-access sites, packet radio, Hacktic... i like it.
NREN, dependency on some power-that-is .. I don't.
--
/rs				Personal replies to: rsweeney@panix.com (please)
** WARNING: My outbound mailer munges addresses!  CHECK ADDRESSES WHEN REPLYING! 
 
______________________________
 
Date: Wed, 21 Apr 1993 12:51:20 -0400
From: Johnny Chrome <woogie@wam.umd.edu>
Subject: Koresh&freedom

Bottom line is, the man put guns in the hands of children and taught them the
correct way to blast their skulls into sloppy chunks when he gave them the
word. That's what my personal opinion of th whole thing rests on.

I think that the incident at Waco (is that what the media handle for it is?)
was not really part of any agenda on the government's part, or else they 
would have dealt with it better. I understand the FBI team which enacted the
siege had no backup team sent to them, and that was a factor in their decision
to move in when they did....sloppy as shit. Makes you hope at least some of
those kids did like Uncle Koresh told them and didn't feel it when they roasted.

But really, I saw this idiot on CBS (I think) spouting off about the mismanagement thing I just mentioned (so take it with salt, I guess) and I realized that 
people who don't use the net only get to hear a few selected media personalities
editorialize their viewpoints on network TV or in the paper....while on the
USENET, and in groups like Future Culture, EVERYBODY gets equal airtime. You 
can't help but analyze and decide your own view; you get to hear so many different opinions all the time.

Which may mean that someday the plug may be pulled by the government, if They 
decide it is in the best interests of power....

After all, the Cold War is over now, and I'm sure everybody picked up the vibes
in that clipper-chip statement from the White House that strongly implied that
the serious "threats" the government will be watching out for will be internal.

The most dangerous threats to the governments control in the coming years will
definately be the intelligent, independantly-motivated young people with the 
knowledge to work the datastream and the courage to look for the truth....

And that's us, I think.
 
 _________________________________________________________________________
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