From: fredxx@spam.invalid 
  
 On 29/07/2025 18:06, JNugent wrote: 
 > On 29/07/2025 11:29 AM, kat wrote: 
 >> On 28/07/2025 17:55, The Todal wrote: 
 >>> On 28/07/2025 11:33, kat wrote: 
 >>>> On 28/07/2025 08:23, Martin Harran wrote: 
 >>>>> On Mon, 28 Jul 2025 00:21:53 +0100, JNugent  
 >>>>> wrote: 
 >>>>> 
 >>>>>> On 27/07/2025 05:25 PM, The Todal wrote: 
 >>>>>> 
 >>>>>>> On 27/07/2025 14:41, JNugent wrote: 
 >>>>>>>> On 27/07/2025 01:00 PM, The Todal wrote: 
 >>>>>>>>> On 27/07/2025 11:40, JNugent wrote: 
 >>>>>>>>>> On 27/07/2025 09:51 AM, The Todal wrote: 
 >>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>>>>> [ ... ] 
 >>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>>>>>> Why are we expected to believe that in all Jewish schools or 
 >>>>>>>>>>> Shuls or 
 >>>>>>>>>>> gatherings, the Jews are scrupulously respectful towards the 
 >>>>>>>>>>> "Arabs" or Palestinians, and to suggest otherwise is a "blood 
 >>>>>>>>>>> libel"? 
 >>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>>>>> Did you go to a Jewish school? 
 >>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>>>> No 
 >>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>>> OK. 
 >>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>>>>> If you did, what was your own experience there? 
 >>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>>>> What has that to do with it? Everyone who went to school in the 
 >>>>>>>>> 1960s 
 >>>>>>>>> can cite bigoted comments and poor teaching methods from some of 
 >>>>>>>>> the 
 >>>>>>>>> people there.€€ Even at our finest public schools. 
 >>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>>> Not from teachers teaching the curriculum in Catholic schools. 
 >>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>> Maybe you are much younger that I supposed. Maybe in your time 
 >>>>>>> there was 
 >>>>>>> a curriculum imposed upon all schools, all teachers, from the 
 >>>>>>> education 
 >>>>>>> authority or, who knows, maybe from the Vatican. 
 >>>>>> 
 >>>>>> No, there wasn't such a national curriculum imposed by Parliament, 
 >>>>>> which 
 >>>>>> must be what you mean. I was a child of the 11+ and grammar schools 
 >>>>>> era. 
 >>>>>> 
 >>>>>> However, the Catholic Church has long been particular about what is 
 >>>>>> taught for RE (which, as you know, even today, is not subject to 
 >>>>>> Parliamentary control as to its content). 
 >>>>>> 
 >>>>>>> Maybe it was virtually unheard of for teachers to introduce 
 >>>>>>> children to 
 >>>>>>> ideas and beliefs that departed, to any extent, from the 
 >>>>>>> "curriculum". 
 >>>>>> 
 >>>>>> I don't it was "virtually unheard of". The art teacher at my grammar 
 >>>>>> school was a noted lefty, supported every strike in the news and 
 >>>>>> let us 
 >>>>>> know as much. 
 >>>>>> 
 >>>>>> Other teachers were more balanced in their presentation of their 
 >>>>>> personal beliefs, except, as ever, the PE teacher, who could not 
 >>>>>> understand - and did not want to understand - any pupil who didn't 
 >>>>>> share 
 >>>>>> his enthusiasm for sports. 
 >>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>> And maybe now, in today's climate, you should try to find the good 
 >>>>>>> manners to accept that some people who are perhaps older than you 
 >>>>>>> can 
 >>>>>>> recall to mind teachers and lessons that would not be acceptable 
 >>>>>>> today. 
 >>>>>> 
 >>>>>> "lessons"? 
 >>>>>> 
 >>>>>> Are you, even now, sure that a teacher's comments - if delivered at 
 >>>>>> all 
 >>>>>> - always count as a lesson? 
 >>>>>> 
 >>>>>> Did the art teacher's support for striking dockers count as a 
 >>>>>> lesson in 
 >>>>>> macroeconomics and sociology? 
 >>>>> 
 >>>>> 
 >>>>> I don't know what age Todal is but I'm 74 and started my education in 
 >>>>> 1956 at a Catholic convent where€€ I did P1 and P2 followed by 5 years 
 >>>>> at a Catholic primary school; that was followed by 5 years (1963 
 >>>>> -1968) at a Catholic grammar school* so I'd think that was fairly 
 >>>>> contemporaneous with period he is referring to. Roughly half the 
 >>>>> teachers at that grammar school were priests and I was taught RE by 
 >>>>> various priests so over my years at school, I would say I was taught 
 >>>>> RE by at least 10 or 11 different/teachers. 
 >>>>> 
 >>>> 
 >>>> I am also 74, and spent my time in ordinary state schools in England, 
 >>>> primary and then a Girl's Grammar school.€€€€ Some sort of RE was i 
 >>>> vaguely recall supposed o be compulsory but i don't rememeber any at 
 >>>> Infants and Juniors, other than morning assembly. 
 >>>> 
 >>>> At the Grammar school we did Scripture the first 3 years, the 
 >>>> cathlics were there too, though they didn't attend assembly until it 
 >>>> was time for announcements.€€ Come O levels we dropped Scripture ( the 
 >>>> syllabus was "too narrow") and had some sort of RE and by 6th form 
 >>>> that was "do you know where you can buy drugs" and "miss, do you kiss 
 >>>> your fianc€€".€€ I knew several boys who attended a Catholic school, 
 >>>> and they weren't all Catholic. only thing that came out of that was 
 >>>> when they queried some point of Catholic doctrine and the staff 
 >>>> couldn't answer! 
 >>>> 
 >>>> But bigotry?€€ None. 
 >>>> 
 >>> 
 >>> I am glad that you had a good experience at school. 
 >>> 
 >>> A while back, I suggested that the antisemitic remarks that my elderly 
 >>> female friend witnessed at her school would have come from batty old 
 >>> nuns who should never have been employed as teachers. 
 >>> 
 >>> I am not in a position to examine their personnel files or their 
 >>> teacher training certificates after this length of time, of course. 
 >>> But I can readily accept that batty, bigoted old nuns are not likely 
 >>> to have been typical of the teaching staff at the average Catholic 
 >>> school in your own day. 
 >>> 
 >>> However, it's also possible that bigotry won't be noticed at the time 
 >>> or stay in the memory forever. In the same way, the Black and White 
  
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