XPost: uk.radio.amateur, uk.politics.misc, uk.d-i-y 
 From: incubus9536612@gmail.com 
  
 On 2019-10-14, The Todal  wrote: 
 > On 14/10/2019 14:31, Incubus wrote: 
 >> On 2019-10-14, The Todal  wrote: 
 >>> On 14/10/2019 13:52, Incubus wrote: 
 >>>> On 2019-10-14, The Natural Philosopher  wrote: 
 >>>>> On 14/10/2019 11:36, Incubus wrote: 
 >>>>>> On 2019-10-14, The Todal  wrote: 
 >>>>>>> On 14/10/2019 10:54, Incubus wrote: 
 >>>>>>>> On 2019-10-13, nightjar  wrote: 
 >>>>>>>>> On 13/10/2019 16:43, tim... wrote: 
 >>>>>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>>>>> "nightjar"  wrote in message 
 >>>>>>>>>> news:YMCdnZDnRYaYlT7AnZ2dnUU78I_NnZ2d@giganews.com... 
 >>>>>>>>> ... 
 >>>>>>>>>>> Of greater influence are probably dissatisfaction with the mess 
 that 
 >>>>>>>>>>> the Brexiteers have made of the process so far 
 >>>>>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>>>>> ITYF it was a Remainer who made a mess of the process 
 >>>>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>>>> Mrs May achieved a reasonable deal that the EU could live with. It 
 was 
 >>>>>>>>> the extreme Brexiteers who stopped that deal getting through 
 parliament. 
 >>>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>>> The deal was an absolute turd but you will find that Remainers in 
 Parliament 
 >>>>>>>> also voted it down. 
 >>>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>> The deal was actually an excellent one, and it is still the only 
 >>>>>>> alternative to a no-deal and there's certainly a chance that MPs will 
 >>>>>>> approve it now they realise that it's this deal or no deal. 
 >>>>>> 
 >>>>>> If you think the deal was excellent then you haven't understood it. 
 >>>>>> 
 >>>>> Or alternatively he realises it is even better than being in the EU, 
 for 
 >>>>> the EU, and hates Britain enough to think that is good. 
 >>>>> 
 >>>>>>> So "absolute turd"? Will you feel betrayed? Will you march on the 
 >>>>>>> streets to demand that Boris resigns, after we leave the EU with 
 Theresa 
 >>>>>>> May's deal? 
 >>>>>>> 
 >>>>>>> Honestly? 
 >>>>>> 
 >>>>>> It depends on what is renegotiated.  The most dangerous aspect was the 
 >>>>>> "backstop". 
 >>>>>> 
 >>>>> The backstop meant 'you can never leave' 
 >>>> 
 >>>> You have read it and understood it.  As you said, either Todal hasn't or 
 he 
 >>>> has and wants the EU to remain as overlords for perpetuity. 
 >>>> 
 >>> 
 >>> Neither of you has understood it. The backstop means that once you have 
 >>> devised a technological solution to regulating the border without having 
 >>> a hard border, the backstop will become irrelevant and the break from 
 >>> the EU will be complete. 
 >> 
 >> So you haven't properly read it then. 
 >> 
 >> Thank you for clarifying. 
 >> 
 > 
 > Bluffing won't get you anywhere. You keep evading the question I've 
 > asked you. If the Theresa May withdrawal agreement is voted through the 
 > Commons and becomes law, will you accept it and move on with your life 
 > or will you spend your life whingeing and moaning that it was a BRINO 
 > and campaigning for a no-deal Brexit? 
  
 It depends what the amendments are.  If the backstop is removed or amended 
 so 
 that it doesn't negate the advantages of leaving for perpetuity and the main 
 agreement altered to promote free trade without the serious drawbacks 
 currently 
 therein, I could accept it.  I wouldn't accept it in its current form.  I 
 think 
 I have made that clear. 
  
 > A "let's wait and see" is the sort of evasion you condemn when it comes 
 > from the Labour Party. 
  
 We don't know what the agreement will be after the current negotiations. 
 There 
 is nothing evasive about refusing to confirm support for something when we 
 don't know what it is.  The clarification I have given you above is 
 something I 
 have previously stated. 
  
 --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05 
  * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)