XPost: uk.d-i-y 
 From: no46764@spam.com 
  
 "IMM"  wrote in message 
 news:bq1ucv$rl0$1@newsg2.svr.pol.co.uk... 
 > 
 > "Fraser"  wrote in message 
 > news:20Wwb.7150$4Y6.4254@newsfep4-winn.server.ntli.net... 
 > > 
 > > Yup, and bars know they now have to make an effort to clean the air. So 
 we 
 > > do have an improvement. 
 > 
 > How many of them?  Few and far between. 
  
 I'd disagree, but you don't seem to be like the socialable type who others 
 would enjoy having around, so your pub experience is probably quite low. 
 Some bars are exceptionally smokey, and some are very clean. The average has 
 improved greatly over the past 50 years. 
  
  
 > Oh my God the addicted are at it again!!  "They would have got it anyway", 
 > and "my granddad died at 90 and chain smoked and was siuper fit (as if)", 
 > etc. 
 > 
 > The probability of getting lung cancer when smoking is massively higher. 
  
 "Massively higher". Cite your source please, MAKING SURE it refers to 
 passive smoking and NOT direct smoking. 
  
  
 > > Your wording is very 
 > > interesting, when scientifically, there isn't really 
 > > away that you can say - 
 > > "She has terminal lung cancer due to 'Second 
 > > Hand Smoke'" and be 100% accurate. 
 > 
 > He fails to understand probabilities. 
  
 I work in professions where langauage has to be accurate. Implying things in 
 text, intended or not, is deceptive and error-prone.  The above statement 
 has nothing to do with "probablities". 
  
  
 > > Tragic. Yes, smoking kills unfortunatly. 
 > > That's never been the debate here. 
 > 
 > Are you mad?   many here are telling us it doesn't or the risk is so low 
 it 
 > is not worth talking about and smokers have this God given right to ruin 
 > other people's health. 
  
 No, we are arguing about PASSIVE SMOKING RISKS. The direct risks to smokers 
 are well documented and not under debate. 
  
 Passive smoking figures are controversial at best, from either side. 
  
  
 > ..and more absolute garbage from the addicted... 
 > 
 > > Hmm, horrible. I smoke in my car, but always 
 > > with the window open. Combined 
 > > with an anti-tobacco air freshener, it's not smelly at all. 
 > 
 > You can NEVER get rid of the awful nicotine small in a car.  The only way 
 is 
 > to replace the capets and roof lining and hope you have wash down leather 
 > seats.  he NEVER goes away. 
  
 And as a non-smoker, you know this how? I'm sure you've been in cars that 
 have had smokers in them, but you've never noticed. 
  
  
 > > > Our estimate was that due to the smoke damage the vehicle had 
 > > > lost 'at least' several thousand dollars due to smoke damage. If 
 > > > you take conservative estimates of a) The loss of value (-$4000); 
 > > > together with 
 > > 
 > > Ignore that, it's small fry. ;-) 
 > 
 > Sure it is! 
  
 Oh, we agree on something? Can we go for a double? What colour is the sky on 
 a clear day? 
  
 F. 
  
 --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05 
  * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)