XPost: alt.bible, alt.christnet, alt.christnet.bible 
 XPost: alt.consciousness.mysticism 
 From: dorewilliamson@verizon.net 
  
 "Ayin" <-ammitusen-@excite.com> wrote in message 
 news:f65075f6.0408040456.7ecbd3b0@posting.google.com... 
  
 > so are you saying that those that confess belief in the bible god 
 > don't commit such nasty behaviors as you discribe and only those who 
 > don't adhere to the bible do?  are you asserting that only bible 
 > believers have ethics/morals? 
  
 No, confessing a belief in the One and ONLY God, that the Bible speaks of, 
 is merely the FIRST step. After having this faith and trust, the believer 
 begins to OBEY the commands, demands and requirements of God to discipline 
 himself to His ways, truths, and will then LIVES accordingly will NOT commit 
 any sin or nasty behavior because of His respect, love and desire for God. I 
 am asserting that the Bible contains the truths, ways, will, power, 
 abilities, Spirit, righteousness, moral relevance, and guidance to walk in 
 ethical and moral ways. 
  
 cont 
 seems to me that religious text has been 
 > used as an excuse to justify all kind of heinous behaviors such as 
 > land theft, genocide and slavery.  please take note of historical 
 > events such as the Inquisition, The Crusades, the genocide of the 
 > Native American and the persecution of Jews and women during the witch 
 > hunts in Europe and simular witch hunts in early America. 
  
 What evil people have done heinously,  in the name of the Bible, perverting 
 it, disobeying it, profaning it in HYPOCRISY, for their own intentions, 
 gains and desires is NOT the Bible or God's fault. The Catholic church , 
 which implemented the Crusades, have  NEVER have obeyed, taught, lived or 
 was true to the teachings of the Bible, ever. If you read the Bible and 
 compare it to the teachings contained therein, you would see that the 
 Catholic Church does NOT abide in it's truths. I don't see how the Jews have 
 been persecuted, when in fact, they have been in control in high places and 
 powers over every nation on the earth, except of course, the Muslim nations. 
 As for witch hunts, if you have ever been a victim of the evil powers of 
 witchcraft, you would be one of the first to want them dead. The problem 
 with the Salem witch trials, is that they didn't know how to determine the 
 true witches from the innocent, and thus in their ignorance, innocent people 
 died. However, what the TRUE witches did, IS horrible, evil, hateful, 
 murderous, problematic and destructive and like I said, if you were ever one 
 of their victims, you would also be screaming for justice. 
  
 cont 
  
 > lol well sure.  live in peace, love, security and brotherhood IF you 
 > happen to be christian ... everyone else goes to hell.  yeah right. 
 > real loving stuff ya got there. 
 > 
  
 God determines HIS rules, plan, demands, commands and requirements, for HE 
 IS GOD, and it just so happens that Jesus Christ and His teachings and words 
 are the ONLY path to GOD. EVIL and those who CHOOSE it, and those who deny, 
 defame, disrespect, dishonor, sin against, and do  all matters of evil, 
 including idolatry, in complete DISOBEDIENCE to their CREATOR, the Father of 
 Christ,  DESERVE hell. It's called JUSTICE. Why do YOU demand being loved, 
 when you offer NONE to your CREATOR and SAVIOR? 
  
 cont 
  
 > methinks theres a difference between being a good person for the sake 
 > of being good and being a good person because you're AFRAID to be 
 > otherwise. 
  
 Being good, in respect, obedience,   honor, and because it is righteous, 
 according to God's will, and LOVING HIM,  is NOT being afraid otherwise. In 
 fact it is the ONLY reason to BE good. 
  
 cont 
  
 > funny that you, who believes in a all encompassing deity, should be so 
 > judgementle.  has your deity turned the job of judgement and 
 > condemnation over to you? 
 Fact is, sweetie, according to the plan of God and salvation, it IS my job 
 to be the JUDGE of mankind. 
  
 John 5:22 
 22 For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the 
 Son: 
 KJV 
  
 cont 
 btw ... since you're talking about taking 
 > responsibilty for bad choices ... how are you take responsibility for 
 > your bad choices when you have someone else (Jesus) paying your sin 
 > debt for you? 
  
 That is the grace, compassion and mercy of a Holy and wonderful God. When 
 you realize your sins, repent, ask for forgiveness, and stop sinning, 
 through your belief in the work of Jesus Christ on the cross, you are 
 forgiven of your sins and bad choices, never to be remembered by God again. 
 ALL mankind are given the same opportunity so don't you think it is stupid 
 to deny and defy it? You are ONLY held accountable and responsible for your 
 evil choices, when you refuse to believe, repent, ask forgiveness and 
 continue in sin and evil. Isn't God wonderful and loving to provide such 
 grace and mercy? 
  
 cont 
 > the bible is just one more religious text. every culture has such 
 > writings.  i've often wondered why the imaginative writings of some 
 > ancient nomadic goat herders should be taken so seriously.  sure ... 
 > ya got some good myths and morality tales in the bible but one has to 
 > wonder why a book that has stories of talking serpents, the sun 
 > standing still in the sky, a woman being turned into a salt lick and a 
 > guy living inside a big fish would be considered "truth". 
 > i find the stories in the Gita to be even more fun to read.  Krishna 
 > saving his buddies from a giant man eating snake or rescueing and 
 > marrying 16000 women at once (and living with them all simultaneously 
 > too!) or twirling an entire mountain on his celestial pinky finger. 
 > pretty cool stories but i certainly doubt that such events occured in 
 > reality. 
  
 Why do you limit God and the Bible to your own imaginations and concepts of 
 reality? God who CREATED the WHOLE Universe, all realms, dimensions, things, 
 times and place, has NO limitations as all things are possible with Him. 
 Apparently you dismiss the wonderful truths, power, abilities, promises, 
 grace, plan of salvation and the history of God, as well as the prophecies 
 until the end of the earth,  with mankind that the Bible provides, and 
 prefer to only mock the incredible and miraculous events that occurred in 
 ancient times. Do you think that only what you perceive in reality of your 
 own life's experiences are all that is possible? If so, then you live a very 
 limited and narrow life, missing the wonderful possibilities that God can 
 provide for your life. 
  
 cont 
 > aaaah i see!  so if someone has more power than you do ... a nasty 
 > despot, say ... one should must not ask questions, one must not judge 
 > the cruel behaviors of the nasty despot, be contempitble of the nasty 
 > despot but one must bow down to the power of the nasty despot because 
 > one doesnt have enough power to fight back and defy the nasty despot. 
 > so apparently your diety doesn't have higher morals than his creations 
  
 [continued in next message] 
  
 --- SoupGate-Win32 v1.05 
  * Origin: you cannot sedate... all the things you hate (1:229/2)